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10:30am Thursday 6th August 2009 in
MORE than 300 Southampton residents have agreed to pay for private “cops” to protect them from crime.
And bosses behind the controversial new community patrol service hope many more will follow after a free three-day trial which gets under way in Shirley today.
Four uniformed security officers equipped with handcuffs and stab vests will be showing residents what they can expect if they agree to pay £3.15 a week or a one-off annual payment of £163.80.
The full Atraks service will include dedicated patrols of eight officers up to 60 times every 24 hours in every community that signs up, special patrols outside schools, escorts to shops and banks, emergency response to alarms and other incidents, and dog handlers to disperse street gangs.
View Shirley Community Patrols in a larger map
Atraks boss Dave MacLean said his officers would be patrolling 18 hours a day during the trial and would “neutralise”
threats to residents using powers of citizen arrest where necessary.
He said they would also be responding to calls from Shirley residents, from allaying fears over groups of youths to escorting the vulnerable.
Mr MacLean said Shirley’s diverse community provided a good testing ground.
Responding to police claims that crime in Shirley was down 7.8 per cent since April, Mr MacLean said it was “still too high”.
He said 337 Shirley residents had already become Atraks members, setting up regular payments, and a further 1,754 said they wanted to join when the service starts.
However, Mr MacLean said no money would be debited until the scheme went ahead. Around three-quarters of residents in a particular community need to sign-up.
The Atraks service, which is independent from the police and council, has come under criticism from a city MP and a senior councillor who branded its marketing tactics “scaremongering”.
But Mr MacLean said: “We hope that people will be able to make up their own minds and will see this is something that will make them feel safe.
“Prevention of crime is what we are all about.”
A police spokesman said they remained “neutral”
about the Atraks service, which will cost more than the £2.73 per week the average Hampshire household pays for real cops.
Test MP Alan Whitehead said: “It still appears their offer is based on exaggerating both a fear of crime and their own legal and practical powers in responding to concerns.
I remain of the view that a paid vigilante service is not the best way to ensure that our communities are kept safe.”
The trial will run each day from noon to 6am.
Further trials are planned across the city.
■ If you live in Shirley and need assistance from Atraks call 07912 109999.
Comments(66)
geronimo
says...
10:43am Thu 6 Aug 09
saint61
says...
10:44am Thu 6 Aug 09
Adrian-Smith
says...
10:46am Thu 6 Aug 09
Was 8 in 76
says...
10:47am Thu 6 Aug 09
binman1234
says...
10:58am Thu 6 Aug 09
Carpe Diem
says...
11:10am Thu 6 Aug 09
Bam Boozler
says...
11:13am Thu 6 Aug 09
Harold Smith 62
says...
11:15am Thu 6 Aug 09
EchoElation
says...
11:15am Thu 6 Aug 09
Adrian-Smith wrote:How can the Police remain neutral, when their taking this guy to court for impersonating a Police Officer?
The Police are sensibly remaining neutral because this service will not survive - it will simply not be cost effective to produce the service promised. Whitehead remains out of touch with the security and safety concerns of the very people who pay his wages - you and me. Fortunately there are less than 12 months left of this train wreck of a Government.
kev63
says...
11:20am Thu 6 Aug 09
Ken Hutchinson wrote:I agree with everything you say, also where will they detain people?
I wonder about the legalities of using dogs to disperse and placing individuals in handcuffs by those who have no actual power of arrest. These chaps are sureley leaving themselves vulnerable to complaints of assault etc. by the person/people they are "neutralising".
THEKILLER
says...
11:20am Thu 6 Aug 09
mick sterbs
says...
11:27am Thu 6 Aug 09
Paramjit Bahia
says...
11:28am Thu 6 Aug 09
St.DaveH
says...
11:32am Thu 6 Aug 09
Adrian-Smith
says...
11:40am Thu 6 Aug 09
Carpe Diem wrote:You forgot to add the amount of downtime for these security officers while they are writing up their statements and appearing as witnesses in Court.
Do some simple maths. 337 residents signed up x 3.15 per week = £1061.55 income. Hours patrolled per week = 18 x 7 = 126 Income per hour = 1061.55 / 126 = £8.42 Now ask yourself this - how many people and dog patrols can Atraks put on the street if as a company they only earn £8.42 per hour. Then ask yourself how many times a day you think you'll see them outside your own house.
Ocean Village resident
says...
11:42am Thu 6 Aug 09
Ocean Village resident
says...
11:44am Thu 6 Aug 09
Adrian-Smith
says...
11:46am Thu 6 Aug 09
EchoElation wrote:The Police should allow this test to proceed. Many different issues can be tested. It will fail, but let's see why - without the Police being accused of causing that failure.
Adrian-Smith wrote: The Police are sensibly remaining neutral because this service will not survive - it will simply not be cost effective to produce the service promised. Whitehead remains out of touch with the security and safety concerns of the very people who pay his wages - you and me. Fortunately there are less than 12 months left of this train wreck of a Government.How can the Police remain neutral, when their taking this guy to court for impersonating a Police Officer? The whole thing stinks, how can they be trusted to be impartial and trustworthy if their not accredited, even CRB checked? I wonder what their history is, they could all be Ex-Bouncers, fired for being too violent!! Ha ha, security word: vote-pain
Redback
says...
11:55am Thu 6 Aug 09
VIVERS
says...
12:06pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Oracle1
says...
12:08pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Rob444
says...
12:11pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Sneakyninja
says...
12:16pm Thu 6 Aug 09
EchoElation wrote:One of them is an ex-doorman and i'm not sure but i think i recognise another one on their website.
Adrian-Smith wrote: The Police are sensibly remaining neutral because this service will not survive - it will simply not be cost effective to produce the service promised. Whitehead remains out of touch with the security and safety concerns of the very people who pay his wages - you and me. Fortunately there are less than 12 months left of this train wreck of a Government.How can the Police remain neutral, when their taking this guy to court for impersonating a Police Officer? The whole thing stinks, how can they be trusted to be impartial and trustworthy if their not accredited, even CRB checked? I wonder what their history is, they could all be Ex-Bouncers, fired for being too violent!! Ha ha, security word: vote-pain
fgh1946
says...
12:21pm Thu 6 Aug 09
geronimo wrote:Knowing some of these brian cells and common decency are definitely not going to be present.
This could be a good thing but ONLY if these security officers are equipped with brain cells and common decency as well as hand cuffs and stab vests. Shame we have to pay over the already expensive police bills but lets face it they just don't seem to be interested in the day to day issues we are having to deal with, and were feed up to the teeth with it!
Huffybear
says...
12:23pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Harold Smith 62 wrote:So all you others don't live in an area that has any crime and which the Police do little to respond to when you report it. Well good for you! Try living in Thornhill then, where antisocial seems to rule, the kids do what they please and the City Patrol is useless because it works from 9-5. Bring them here and I guarantee that people will pay for this too.
If people want to pay for extra security why shouldn't they?
binman1234
says...
12:29pm Thu 6 Aug 09
crumps
says...
12:32pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Derek of Dibden Purlieu
says...
12:46pm Thu 6 Aug 09
binman1234 wrote:Sadly Binman (says it all) may have his eyes opened if son gets detained by someone making a citizens arrest. Perhaps the Magistrate may offer a better deal if they both appear together after dad comes down to 'sort it out'. The binman might be doing his son a greater service by explaining that he shouldn't do something that will cause him to be detained in the first place.
grown ups playing cowboy and indians iff they stop me ill tell them to fxxxoxxx they have now power to arrest and iff they stop and detain me i would take them to court they are in for 1 big headack from the heads winding them up up every day ,,,i have told my son to ignore them iff they stop you and phone me to come down and sort them out,,,,,,,my son will only stop when asked by warden ,,comunity patrol ,,or police ,i advise outhers to do the same they might be perverts or violent we dont know iff they are not veted
Derek of Dibden Purlieu
says...
12:50pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Oracle1 wrote:Are you still on the treatment programme or have you escaped again?
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.
These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.
Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
Nearly an OAP
says...
1:13pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Redback
says...
1:26pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Parksey
says...
1:27pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Rob444 wrote:Brilliant!
Either the security company has a highly persuasive sales force or the people of Shirley are excessively gullible (these are not mutually exclusive).
soton1980
says...
1:39pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Ken Hutchinson wrote:This Antraks police force worries me... as I've said before, if this were to be successful, I could easily see nightclubs paying for this service too, which would be incredibly dangerous. Whilst I must stress that most bouncers I've met do a very good job and are well trained, a minority abuse the position over vulnerable intoxicated people. I've had incidents of a bouncer telling me to reenter a building which has just been evacuated due to a fire alarm, bouncers threatening me for something I hadn't done, etc.
I wonder about the legalities of using dogs to disperse and placing individuals in handcuffs by those who have no actual power of arrest. These chaps are sureley leaving themselves vulnerable to complaints of assault etc. by the person/people they are "neutralising".
dyjps
says...
1:55pm Thu 6 Aug 09
goard
says...
2:02pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Oracle1
says...
2:12pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:Derek of Dibden
Oracle1 wrote:Are you still on the treatment programme or have you escaped again?
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.
These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.
Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
johnbullas
says...
2:20pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Derek of Dibden Purlieu
says...
2:23pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Oracle1 wrote:"Simplistic thoughts" or realistic thoughts perhaps? Perhaps a little experiment for you might be to visit the Bargate area on a Saturday night at chucking out time and try to reason with the people you encounter. Your ego knows no fear but you may end up fighting someone else's personal tanked up demons. A little love and peace normally works with a group of drinkers with ten pints of wife beater in their guts. They'll be like putty in your hands or you may end up in the neurological ward of the General Hospital.
Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:Derek of Dibden
Oracle1 wrote:Are you still on the treatment programme or have you escaped again?
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.
These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.
Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
No, I am perfectly sane. I am just a consciously thinking person that wants to do my bit to make the world a better place. If you think that the world is currently sane, then I feel sorry for you. Simplistic thoughts and cheap shots are part of our problems, try feeling more comfortable in your own skin, you then might not need to react in a particular way.
K999
says...
2:29pm Thu 6 Aug 09
mick sterbs
says...
2:52pm Thu 6 Aug 09
johnbullas
says...
2:53pm Thu 6 Aug 09
binman1234
says...
3:07pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:you have taken the coments wrong mr dibden man ,,,,my son is well behaved and not some street hanger or drinker he spends most time indoors ,,,,or at girlfriends house ,,i was making figure of speach so called no one has the right to stop you except the police ,,or council ,,or warden etc not vigilantiys etc hope this makes it clear and i do live in a council area with a young person problem ...kids are not all bad just a few
binman1234 wrote: grown ups playing cowboy and indians iff they stop me ill tell them to fxxxoxxx they have now power to arrest and iff they stop and detain me i would take them to court they are in for 1 big headack from the heads winding them up up every day ,,,i have told my son to ignore them iff they stop you and phone me to come down and sort them out,,,,,,,my son will only stop when asked by warden ,,comunity patrol ,,or police ,i advise outhers to do the same they might be perverts or violent we dont know iff they are not vetedSadly Binman (says it all) may have his eyes opened if son gets detained by someone making a citizens arrest. Perhaps the Magistrate may offer a better deal if they both appear together after dad comes down to 'sort it out'. The binman might be doing his son a greater service by explaining that he shouldn't do something that will cause him to be detained in the first place.
Polygonia
says...
3:15pm Thu 6 Aug 09
S!mon
says...
3:55pm Thu 6 Aug 09
binman1234 wrote:But, figuratively speaking, if your son was making a prat of himself then they could detain him?
Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:you have taken the coments wrong mr dibden man ,,,,my son is well behaved and not some street hanger or drinker he spends most time indoors ,,,,or at girlfriends house ,,i was making figure of speach so called no one has the right to stop you except the police ,,or council ,,or warden etc not vigilantiys etc hope this makes it clear and i do live in a council area with a young person problem ...kids are not all bad just a fewbinman1234 wrote: grown ups playing cowboy and indians iff they stop me ill tell them to fxxxoxxx they have now power to arrest and iff they stop and detain me i would take them to court they are in for 1 big headack from the heads winding them up up every day ,,,i have told my son to ignore them iff they stop you and phone me to come down and sort them out,,,,,,,my son will only stop when asked by warden ,,comunity patrol ,,or police ,i advise outhers to do the same they might be perverts or violent we dont know iff they are not vetedSadly Binman (says it all) may have his eyes opened if son gets detained by someone making a citizens arrest. Perhaps the Magistrate may offer a better deal if they both appear together after dad comes down to 'sort it out'. The binman might be doing his son a greater service by explaining that he shouldn't do something that will cause him to be detained in the first place.
Finlay
says...
4:06pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Lone Ranger
says...
4:22pm Thu 6 Aug 09
K999 wrote:It is abit odd that no-one in that area has come on hear and said "yes iam paying".
Well my street is indicated on the map. Knew nothing aobut this until it was reported in The Echo. No canvessing, flyers, knock on the door etc offering the service. Seems odd to me.
senseofsouthampton
says...
4:32pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Lord Vader
says...
5:46pm Thu 6 Aug 09
echo say
says...
6:05pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Bemused reader
says...
6:11pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Donald2000
says...
6:38pm Thu 6 Aug 09
r50mini
says...
6:48pm Thu 6 Aug 09
King Mush
says...
7:18pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Oracle1 wrote:Wow! We have a Hare Krishna temple here in Woolston!
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.
These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.
Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
King Mush
says...
7:23pm Thu 6 Aug 09
X Old Bill
says...
7:53pm Thu 6 Aug 09
gorf
says...
8:55pm Thu 6 Aug 09
B. L.
says...
9:30pm Thu 6 Aug 09
X Old Bill wrote:At last, someone who can see the wood for the trees, as well as P.B. You are absolutely right, the country is controlled by Brussels who are probably laughing their socks off at the plight of "Great Britain" (keep the subsidies coming). The monkeys in Westminster try to appear in control but the only control they are interested in is taxing everyone to the hilt with zero return, except for themselves. Your last paragraph is spot on, this is no more than a protection scam. They have no authority whatsoever, no matter what power they believe themselves to have, and if people believe this is the answer to REAL policing, then the place is in a sorrier state than one can imagine.I don't always agree with his political stance, but for once I totally agree with Paramjit Bahia's post, he tells it the way it should be. People, if you place your trust in these wannabees, your future doesn't look too bright and I really feel for you.
The Police 'Service' as it used to be has over the years lost respect and lost control of the situation. This has largely come about through the respect and control being taken away, rather than given up. It has happened as a result of the plethora of newer and more 'inclusive' legislation produced by both Brussels and Westminster. On top of this we now have vastly better news media and communications than in even the recent past.The result is a perception of crime being much worse, the phrase used by politicians is: Fear of Crime. Something Nu-labour said that they would deal with....
Security companies such as this try fill this apparent gap in the market and play up the fear rather than any facts. It happened in New York many years ago with the 'Guardian Angels' This prompted the NY Transit Police to get their act together and the GA are no longer necessary. They tried to start it on London Transport but lasted less than a week as I recall.
It does not help the discussion if the News media keep calling these Security Guards 'Officers', 'Cops' and even 'Police'. They are none of these things, in order to be so called they would require a regulatory Act of Parliament, as is the case with Parks Police and others.
theworldisfullofcrashingbores
says...
10:42pm Thu 6 Aug 09
Mr BCB
says...
10:59pm Thu 6 Aug 09
driverbelcher
says...
11:12pm Thu 6 Aug 09
dyjps wrote:Erm, no I don't remember back in the 1600's because this would make me around 400 years old! What a ridiculous statement!!
Do you remember back in the 1600's when you insured your property against fire and had a plaque on the wall to say so. Will those who pay have to do the same? No plaque = no protection?
Donald2000
says...
6:16am Fri 7 Aug 09
GDNeil
says...
8:09am Fri 7 Aug 09
peachy1
says...
8:42am Fri 7 Aug 09
Sierra33
says...
11:48am Fri 7 Aug 09
mamamia24
says...
3:23pm Fri 7 Aug 09
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Ken Hutchinson says...
10:42am Thu 6 Aug 09