News RSS Feed


Follow the Daily Echo on Facebook to get headlines straight to your news feed. Readers Letters Tweet with the Daily Echo Don't Be A Fuel Fool

Shirley residents pay for private security firm Atraks


MORE than 300 Southampton residents have agreed to pay for private “cops” to protect them from crime.

And bosses behind the controversial new community patrol service hope many more will follow after a free three-day trial which gets under way in Shirley today.

Four uniformed security officers equipped with handcuffs and stab vests will be showing residents what they can expect if they agree to pay £3.15 a week or a one-off annual payment of £163.80.

The full Atraks service will include dedicated patrols of eight officers up to 60 times every 24 hours in every community that signs up, special patrols outside schools, escorts to shops and banks, emergency response to alarms and other incidents, and dog handlers to disperse street gangs.


View Shirley Community Patrols in a larger map

Atraks boss Dave MacLean said his officers would be patrolling 18 hours a day during the trial and would “neutralise”

threats to residents using powers of citizen arrest where necessary.

He said they would also be responding to calls from Shirley residents, from allaying fears over groups of youths to escorting the vulnerable.

Mr MacLean said Shirley’s diverse community provided a good testing ground.

Responding to police claims that crime in Shirley was down 7.8 per cent since April, Mr MacLean said it was “still too high”.

He said 337 Shirley residents had already become Atraks members, setting up regular payments, and a further 1,754 said they wanted to join when the service starts.

However, Mr MacLean said no money would be debited until the scheme went ahead. Around three-quarters of residents in a particular community need to sign-up.

Click below to see a video of today's headlines in sixty seconds

The Atraks service, which is independent from the police and council, has come under criticism from a city MP and a senior councillor who branded its marketing tactics “scaremongering”.

But Mr MacLean said: “We hope that people will be able to make up their own minds and will see this is something that will make them feel safe.

“Prevention of crime is what we are all about.”

A police spokesman said they remained “neutral”

about the Atraks service, which will cost more than the £2.73 per week the average Hampshire household pays for real cops.

Test MP Alan Whitehead said: “It still appears their offer is based on exaggerating both a fear of crime and their own legal and practical powers in responding to concerns.

I remain of the view that a paid vigilante service is not the best way to ensure that our communities are kept safe.”

The trial will run each day from noon to 6am.

Further trials are planned across the city.

■ If you live in Shirley and need assistance from Atraks call 07912 109999.


Comments(66)

Ken Hutchinson says...
10:42am Thu 6 Aug 09

I wonder about the legalities of using dogs to disperse and placing individuals in handcuffs by those who have no actual power of arrest. These chaps are sureley leaving themselves vulnerable to complaints of assault etc. by the person/people they are "neutralising".

geronimo says...
10:43am Thu 6 Aug 09

This could be a good thing but ONLY if these security officers are equipped with brain cells and common decency as well as hand cuffs and stab vests. Shame we have to pay over the already expensive police bills but lets face it they just don't seem to be interested in the day to day issues we are having to deal with, and were feed up to the teeth with it!

saint61 says...
10:44am Thu 6 Aug 09

52 x £3.15 = £163.80 the same as a one off payment of £163.80
Normally you get a cheaper deal for a one off payment......just a thought

Adrian-Smith says...
10:46am Thu 6 Aug 09

The Police are sensibly remaining neutral because this service will not survive - it will simply not be cost effective to produce the service promised.

Whitehead remains out of touch with the security and safety concerns of the very people who pay his wages - you and me. Fortunately there are less than 12 months left of this train wreck of a Government.


Was 8 in 76 says...
10:47am Thu 6 Aug 09

Surely the police should be doing this job we pay enough bloody tax.

binman1234 says...
10:58am Thu 6 Aug 09

first time i asked for a call by one of the patrol i was told that no one was available for an hour ,,,,,they were rude to me on the phone ,,,,,,no one answeres the call center number ..probably just his home number no one actualy there ,,,,there drivers have been speading up and down our estate at great over the limit speed ,no thanks just vigitanties in a uniform with no powers,,,come on the police ,,,ps i spoke to the local pcso they do not want them ,,and say they are dangerus in the comunity i agree

Carpe Diem says...
11:10am Thu 6 Aug 09

Do some simple maths.

337 residents signed up x 3.15 per week = £1061.55 income.

Hours patrolled per week = 18 x 7 = 126

Income per hour = 1061.55 / 126 = £8.42

Now ask yourself this - how many people and dog patrols can Atraks put on the street if as a company they only earn £8.42 per hour.

Then ask yourself how many times a day you think you'll see them outside your own house.

Bam Boozler says...
11:13am Thu 6 Aug 09

And the 20 minutes of fame for these sad wannabes starts......now!!!

Harold Smith 62 says...
11:15am Thu 6 Aug 09

If people want to pay for extra security why shouldn't they?

EchoElation says...
11:15am Thu 6 Aug 09

Adrian-Smith wrote:
The Police are sensibly remaining neutral because this service will not survive - it will simply not be cost effective to produce the service promised. Whitehead remains out of touch with the security and safety concerns of the very people who pay his wages - you and me. Fortunately there are less than 12 months left of this train wreck of a Government.
How can the Police remain neutral, when their taking this guy to court for impersonating a Police Officer?

The whole thing stinks, how can they be trusted to be impartial and trustworthy if their not accredited, even CRB checked?

I wonder what their history is, they could all be Ex-Bouncers, fired for being too violent!!

Ha ha, security word: vote-pain

kev63 says...
11:20am Thu 6 Aug 09

Ken Hutchinson wrote:
I wonder about the legalities of using dogs to disperse and placing individuals in handcuffs by those who have no actual power of arrest. These chaps are sureley leaving themselves vulnerable to complaints of assault etc. by the person/people they are "neutralising".
I agree with everything you say, also where will they detain people?

THEKILLER says...
11:20am Thu 6 Aug 09

Nothing more than vigilanty thugs "neutralising threats" isn't that how the Nazis started?

mick sterbs says...
11:27am Thu 6 Aug 09

300 x 163 is just under 50k, thats not enough to pay these plastic coppers and run there vehicles etc for long. unless the berks are working for peanuts.

I would happily let a copper clip my boys ear or arrest him if he does wrong, but one of these puts cuffs on or lets a dog bite him i'll sue the backside off them.

all this will do is get the local scum going out to wind these berks up and will pull 'wan'a'go' hoodlums into the area. the hoodies will love having someone to play with.


Paramjit Bahia says...
11:28am Thu 6 Aug 09

At one time Chief Constables (Both John Duke and John Hodinott) were rightly opposed to private policing. So I am amazed at the neutral stance on this serious issue by our police.

Basically this is step in the wrong direction i.e. protection rackets of future.

Rather than paying the policing charge along with council tax and this extortion on top, if people are not happy with policing standards, they should demand better response from Chief Constable, members of the Police Authority and the Home Secretary.

Safety and security should be provided for everybody without consideration of affordability. Schemes like this even if they do work, which I doubt, will only provide cover to those who have too much money to waste. Most pensioners can hardly afford to feed themselves they can’t afford these kind of extortions.

Even the vultures only eat the dead, so what can we say about those who will demand £3-15 weekly from a poor old age pensioner, disabled or vulnerable person?

St.DaveH says...
11:32am Thu 6 Aug 09

It is a shame the general public have lost faith in the police responding to minor criminal activity and ASB. Some of these so called minor incidents have a severe detrimental impact on our communities, and better reassurance should be afforded to the elderly and more vulnerable.
The correct way of dealing with the day to day offences is simply to make the funds available to the police authority to ensure the adequate deployment of officers, if people are willing to pay for a private service, I’ am sure they would pay more for better street level policing; providing they see value for money.
Plastic police are not the answer.

Adrian-Smith says...
11:40am Thu 6 Aug 09

Carpe Diem wrote:
Do some simple maths. 337 residents signed up x 3.15 per week = £1061.55 income. Hours patrolled per week = 18 x 7 = 126 Income per hour = 1061.55 / 126 = £8.42 Now ask yourself this - how many people and dog patrols can Atraks put on the street if as a company they only earn £8.42 per hour. Then ask yourself how many times a day you think you'll see them outside your own house.
You forgot to add the amount of downtime for these security officers while they are writing up their statements and appearing as witnesses in Court.

Leave the service alone - it's a useful test exercise - but will fail within months.

Ocean Village resident says...
11:42am Thu 6 Aug 09

The people creating the problems don't respect the police so quite what attitude they will adopt towards these 'officers' is questionable...

Ocean Village resident says...
11:44am Thu 6 Aug 09

Poor grammar again on the headline too...tut tut..

Adrian-Smith says...
11:46am Thu 6 Aug 09

EchoElation wrote:
Adrian-Smith wrote: The Police are sensibly remaining neutral because this service will not survive - it will simply not be cost effective to produce the service promised. Whitehead remains out of touch with the security and safety concerns of the very people who pay his wages - you and me. Fortunately there are less than 12 months left of this train wreck of a Government.
How can the Police remain neutral, when their taking this guy to court for impersonating a Police Officer? The whole thing stinks, how can they be trusted to be impartial and trustworthy if their not accredited, even CRB checked? I wonder what their history is, they could all be Ex-Bouncers, fired for being too violent!! Ha ha, security word: vote-pain
The Police should allow this test to proceed. Many different issues can be tested. It will fail, but let's see why - without the Police being accused of causing that failure.

Redback says...
11:55am Thu 6 Aug 09

Tell you what. I'm 6 foot, and I'm sure I could rustle up a few other big blokes to help.

Anyone fancy paying me to 'patrol' their streets?

What makes this any difference from a vigilante mob?

VIVERS says...
12:06pm Thu 6 Aug 09

hold on a min the last time i checked my council tax bill i was already paying for the police not to police our streets. the last time i contacted the police for a stolen motorcycle they didnt even come and see me thanks guys!!!
but sod it if i am paying again, they should be working harder. they said we needed more bobbie on the beat so they provide play coppers who can do anything the uk as gone to the dogs and it shows.

Oracle1 says...
12:08pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.

These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.

Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.

Rob444 says...
12:11pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Either the security company has a highly persuasive sales force or the people of Shirley are excessively gullible (these are not mutually exclusive).

Sneakyninja says...
12:16pm Thu 6 Aug 09

EchoElation wrote:
Adrian-Smith wrote: The Police are sensibly remaining neutral because this service will not survive - it will simply not be cost effective to produce the service promised. Whitehead remains out of touch with the security and safety concerns of the very people who pay his wages - you and me. Fortunately there are less than 12 months left of this train wreck of a Government.
How can the Police remain neutral, when their taking this guy to court for impersonating a Police Officer? The whole thing stinks, how can they be trusted to be impartial and trustworthy if their not accredited, even CRB checked? I wonder what their history is, they could all be Ex-Bouncers, fired for being too violent!! Ha ha, security word: vote-pain
One of them is an ex-doorman and i'm not sure but i think i recognise another one on their website.

Who honestly signed up for their service?? Personaly i don't think anyone did and they're making all their figures up. 337 with another 1'754 waiting to sign on??

Get real.

fgh1946 says...
12:21pm Thu 6 Aug 09

geronimo wrote:
This could be a good thing but ONLY if these security officers are equipped with brain cells and common decency as well as hand cuffs and stab vests. Shame we have to pay over the already expensive police bills but lets face it they just don't seem to be interested in the day to day issues we are having to deal with, and were feed up to the teeth with it!
Knowing some of these brian cells and common decency are definitely not going to be present.

Huffybear says...
12:23pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Harold Smith 62 wrote:
If people want to pay for extra security why shouldn't they?
So all you others don't live in an area that has any crime and which the Police do little to respond to when you report it. Well good for you! Try living in Thornhill then, where antisocial seems to rule, the kids do what they please and the City Patrol is useless because it works from 9-5. Bring them here and I guarantee that people will pay for this too.

binman1234 says...
12:29pm Thu 6 Aug 09

grown ups playing cowboy and indians iff they stop me ill tell them to fxxxoxxx they have now power to arrest and iff they stop and detain me i would take them to court they are in for 1 big headack from the heads winding them up up every day ,,,i have told my son to ignore them iff they stop you and phone me to come down and sort them out,,,,,,,my son will only stop when asked by warden ,,comunity patrol ,,or police ,i advise outhers to do the same they might be perverts or violent we dont know iff they are not veted

crumps says...
12:32pm Thu 6 Aug 09

these "officers" have less power than the current community police officers, how is this progress? they will not be able to deliver or maintain the minimal levels they state so surely should be fined for false advertising?

Derek of Dibden Purlieu says...
12:46pm Thu 6 Aug 09

binman1234 wrote:
grown ups playing cowboy and indians iff they stop me ill tell them to fxxxoxxx they have now power to arrest and iff they stop and detain me i would take them to court they are in for 1 big headack from the heads winding them up up every day ,,,i have told my son to ignore them iff they stop you and phone me to come down and sort them out,,,,,,,my son will only stop when asked by warden ,,comunity patrol ,,or police ,i advise outhers to do the same they might be perverts or violent we dont know iff they are not veted
Sadly Binman (says it all) may have his eyes opened if son gets detained by someone making a citizens arrest. Perhaps the Magistrate may offer a better deal if they both appear together after dad comes down to 'sort it out'. The binman might be doing his son a greater service by explaining that he shouldn't do something that will cause him to be detained in the first place.

Derek of Dibden Purlieu says...
12:50pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Oracle1 wrote:
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.

These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.

Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
Are you still on the treatment programme or have you escaped again?

Nearly an OAP says...
1:13pm Thu 6 Aug 09

This private police force, as stated, has not much chance of lasting too long because of the running costs. I suppose it's better than vigilantes patrolling the streets but not much. High profile policing has always paid off - but it's the CPS and the courts who let the system down. PCSOs are visible but don't seem to have the respect of the majority of the public. police who are the objects of abuse and worse, mainly by young people. It looks like a paramilitary police force will have to eventually be created who will instil an element of fear into the public to gain their respect.

Redback says...
1:26pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Fear and Respect are mutually exclusive IMO. Fear is merely a poor counterfeit.

Parksey says...
1:27pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Rob444 wrote:
Either the security company has a highly persuasive sales force or the people of Shirley are excessively gullible (these are not mutually exclusive).
Brilliant!

It would be interesting to hear this firm's sales pitch, particularly towards the very elderly or other more vulnerable members of society. I suspect we'll be seeing them on "Rogue Traders" in the very near future.

I'm still at a loss as to exactly what powers these people have and what they can actually do to "neutralise" any supposed threats... As has been mentioned previously, this actually sounds like it amounts to nothing more than extortion.

soton1980 says...
1:39pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Ken Hutchinson wrote:
I wonder about the legalities of using dogs to disperse and placing individuals in handcuffs by those who have no actual power of arrest. These chaps are sureley leaving themselves vulnerable to complaints of assault etc. by the person/people they are "neutralising".
This Antraks police force worries me... as I've said before, if this were to be successful, I could easily see nightclubs paying for this service too, which would be incredibly dangerous. Whilst I must stress that most bouncers I've met do a very good job and are well trained, a minority abuse the position over vulnerable intoxicated people. I've had incidents of a bouncer telling me to reenter a building which has just been evacuated due to a fire alarm, bouncers threatening me for something I hadn't done, etc.

Not to mention the sad story of the bouncer who left that student paralised after a night out in Kaos.

The Police have special training in the limits of their powers and who they have a right to arrest. They also fully know citizens rights and are taught to respect them. This private firm will not have that level of training and that makes them very dangerous indeed. How long until they perform a false arrest on someone who has been falsely accused and is innocent? What about if a suspect is resisting arrest (for whatever reason) and they start using batons against him/her... and what about the legality of using potentially violent dogs against people?




dyjps says...
1:55pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Do you remember back in the 1600's when you insured your property against fire and had a plaque on the wall to say so. Will those who pay have to do the same? No plaque = no protection?

goard says...
2:02pm Thu 6 Aug 09

I see a community that has been decimated (my favourite word at the moment). Where oh where did it all start? Atrax (secret police)? I do not know if it is by design or a fluke that Government has caused this catastrophic disorganisation. It appears to be 'Bring in more troops' we are getting to the point of fearfulness for ourselves and our country. It may be the media making more than it is - there is no smoke without fire, but can I point out there are some of us fearful at the modern day trend of insurrection. Take Notice, our youth will, eventually, be those children we see in 'News' on tele - throwing stones at opposing forces - I am fearful because we could quite well become the epitome of these scenes. Government, please stop this trend - it may be the end of civilisation as we know it. In some of your ivory towers your families may become one of the victims. It is just a small chink - but it is dangerous times.

goard

Oracle1 says...
2:12pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:
Oracle1 wrote:
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.

These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.

Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
Are you still on the treatment programme or have you escaped again?
Derek of Dibden

No, I am perfectly sane. I am just a consciously thinking person that wants to do my bit to make the world a better place. If you think that the world is currently sane, then I feel sorry for you. Simplistic thoughts and cheap shots are part of our problems, try feeling more comfortable in your own skin, you then might not need to react in a particular way.

johnbullas says...
2:20pm Thu 6 Aug 09

If, on their patrols, the house next door (not a paying customer) is being broken into are they obliged to call the police? You would expect an honest citizen to do something would you not? But the burglary of a non-client in the area would be good for promoting business?

Derek of Dibden Purlieu says...
2:23pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Oracle1 wrote:
Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:
Oracle1 wrote:
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.

These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.

Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
Are you still on the treatment programme or have you escaped again?
Derek of Dibden

No, I am perfectly sane. I am just a consciously thinking person that wants to do my bit to make the world a better place. If you think that the world is currently sane, then I feel sorry for you. Simplistic thoughts and cheap shots are part of our problems, try feeling more comfortable in your own skin, you then might not need to react in a particular way.
"Simplistic thoughts" or realistic thoughts perhaps? Perhaps a little experiment for you might be to visit the Bargate area on a Saturday night at chucking out time and try to reason with the people you encounter. Your ego knows no fear but you may end up fighting someone else's personal tanked up demons. A little love and peace normally works with a group of drinkers with ten pints of wife beater in their guts. They'll be like putty in your hands or you may end up in the neurological ward of the General Hospital.

K999 says...
2:29pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Well my street is indicated on the map. Knew nothing aobut this until it was reported in The Echo. No canvessing, flyers, knock on the door etc offering the service. Seems odd to me.

mick sterbs says...
2:52pm Thu 6 Aug 09

this post may get 'bumped' due tho the echo's love of Polish but when you put 'atraks' in a search engine you get loads of Polish sites.

is this a Polish franchise system that they are trying to introduce here.

could the echo investigate this and see how it works in Poland, especially in relation to whether the polish police are as good as ours etc etc.

go on Echo, do some real investigative journalism......

johnbullas says...
2:53pm Thu 6 Aug 09

http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/Wandsworth_
Parks_Police for the local authority delivered option

binman1234 says...
3:07pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:
binman1234 wrote: grown ups playing cowboy and indians iff they stop me ill tell them to fxxxoxxx they have now power to arrest and iff they stop and detain me i would take them to court they are in for 1 big headack from the heads winding them up up every day ,,,i have told my son to ignore them iff they stop you and phone me to come down and sort them out,,,,,,,my son will only stop when asked by warden ,,comunity patrol ,,or police ,i advise outhers to do the same they might be perverts or violent we dont know iff they are not veted
Sadly Binman (says it all) may have his eyes opened if son gets detained by someone making a citizens arrest. Perhaps the Magistrate may offer a better deal if they both appear together after dad comes down to 'sort it out'. The binman might be doing his son a greater service by explaining that he shouldn't do something that will cause him to be detained in the first place.
you have taken the coments wrong mr dibden man ,,,,my son is well behaved and not some street hanger or drinker he spends most time indoors ,,,,or at girlfriends house ,,i was making figure of speach so called no one has the right to stop you except the police ,,or council ,,or warden etc not vigilantiys etc hope this makes it clear and i do live in a council area with a young person problem ...kids are not all bad just a few

Polygonia says...
3:15pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Anyone who is out on the streets at night
could cause a cut down in minor crime because they can see what is going on and at least call the police. The more calls that are recorded the more likely politicians are to take the crime figures seriously.

S!mon says...
3:55pm Thu 6 Aug 09

binman1234 wrote:
Derek of Dibden Purlieu wrote:
binman1234 wrote: grown ups playing cowboy and indians iff they stop me ill tell them to fxxxoxxx they have now power to arrest and iff they stop and detain me i would take them to court they are in for 1 big headack from the heads winding them up up every day ,,,i have told my son to ignore them iff they stop you and phone me to come down and sort them out,,,,,,,my son will only stop when asked by warden ,,comunity patrol ,,or police ,i advise outhers to do the same they might be perverts or violent we dont know iff they are not veted
Sadly Binman (says it all) may have his eyes opened if son gets detained by someone making a citizens arrest. Perhaps the Magistrate may offer a better deal if they both appear together after dad comes down to 'sort it out'. The binman might be doing his son a greater service by explaining that he shouldn't do something that will cause him to be detained in the first place.
you have taken the coments wrong mr dibden man ,,,,my son is well behaved and not some street hanger or drinker he spends most time indoors ,,,,or at girlfriends house ,,i was making figure of speach so called no one has the right to stop you except the police ,,or council ,,or warden etc not vigilantiys etc hope this makes it clear and i do live in a council area with a young person problem ...kids are not all bad just a few
But, figuratively speaking, if your son was making a prat of himself then they could detain him?

Finlay says...
4:06pm Thu 6 Aug 09

No-one told you guys that you're already paying for policing in the community.

If you subscribe to this Atracks policy then can you deduct that from the amount you pay for policing?

It also confirms that the public have little faith in the Dollops and so are getting the job done and keeping them safer in their homes.

Lone Ranger says...
4:22pm Thu 6 Aug 09

K999 wrote:
Well my street is indicated on the map. Knew nothing aobut this until it was reported in The Echo. No canvessing, flyers, knock on the door etc offering the service. Seems odd to me.
It is abit odd that no-one in that area has come on hear and said "yes iam paying".

Like you it seems odd and my guess is its a load of old bull.

Come on Atraks give us the truth.

senseofsouthampton says...
4:32pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Isn't citizen's arrest limited to crimes above a certain severity?

The reason I don't think this will work is the excludability issue. These guys are going to be patrolling a street where some people have paid. In which case the rest in that street who haven't paid are receiving the service too. Soon people will work out that there's no point in paying and this idea will fizzle out.

Anyone know if this has been trialled or rolled out anywhere else in the UK?

Lord Vader says...
5:46pm Thu 6 Aug 09

For the majority on here, **** and moaning about "vigilantes" and "Bouncers" seems to be somewhat of a favourite hobby.
You all seem to have a problem with security in general.
You would soon quit your pathetic ranting if all of the security staff in southampton decided to not turn up for work this weekend and then you would see some chaos! No Doorstaff, No security staff in shops, lets see how far that would stretch the already overworked police in our city, my guess is that if that were to happen that half of you would be too scared to leave your homes and the other half would cause riots and go looting, these guys have done nothing wrong as of yet so why hypothesize over thier conduct or potential problems they may face, let them get on with it, if any of them step out of line then im sure they will be dealt with by the authorities, they are attempting to provide safer communities for all who are willing to pay a small sum, most of whom obviously do not feel safe in thier communities.
Unfortunately none of the good that they do will be printed by the daily echo as they seem hellbent on sensationalist rant, the good stuff just doesnt sell papers.
Just them neing seen in these areas is a good thing, if it stops even 1 person from being beaten or stabbed, 1 home from being burgled, 1 girl from being raped then it has to be a good thing, you will never even hear of any of these things as just through providing a precence it may have been averted so there would be nothing to report. I for one will not pay for the service but fair play to these guys for putting themselves out there and being prepared to step up, as you can see from thier figures and the negative response from you lot they will have a tough time.

echo say says...
6:05pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Get rid of human rights let the police do there duty take away all the goodies out of the prisons make judge trigger king

Bemused reader says...
6:11pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Perhaps I miss ready the earlier articles on this but I read and understood thatthe patrols would be for 24 hours a day 7 days a week. If that is the case why is the trial period only doing 18 hours.

I agree if people what to pay for this service thats fine, but at the same time, it could i suppose be considered as a way of explotating the weak and vunerable.

Donald2000 says...
6:38pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Excellent. Here we have a company who will not have the faintest idea about the law, or policing, let lose on a community to do damage. I hope the residents of Shirley realise what foolishness they will have committed when it all goes pear shaped, or when this firm absconds with their money. Dont say you were not warned.

r50mini says...
6:48pm Thu 6 Aug 09

This is nothing short of scaremongering and intimidation. Uncontrolled vigilantes placing people in handcuffs is illegal and classed as kidnapping and using dogs to disperse gang's, I hope the Police will be using the Dangerous Dogs act against them. These people may wear a uniform, but they have no more powers than any other individual on the street and definitely none to restrain a member of the public. I recommend that everyone who is detained or intimidated by these thugs, takes them to court.

King Mush says...
7:18pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Oracle1 wrote:
Fear, anger, hate, resentment. All negative emotions that fuel the problems we have in society, our external worlds are reflections of how we feel inside. If we battle our own personal demons you will find the world far more forgiving. What you put out, you get back, call it cause & effect, Karma or what ever you like.

These people have come about purely because of the fear each of us has and projects daily, is it possible to live with out fear, of course it is. Live in the now, the present moment, do you feel fear right now? Our ego's love to keep us in fear, thinking about the past and worrying about the future, blaming accusing etc. The world is the way it is because of our own individual and collective neurotic nature.

Bring more love and peace in to your life, see it start spreading to your external environment, it works.
Wow! We have a Hare Krishna temple here in Woolston!


Count me in man.


(cant shave my head though)

KM Pretty good on the fingerbells

King Mush says...
7:23pm Thu 6 Aug 09

Why bang on about 'neutralising' the scum?


Better to 'neuter' the parents!

X Old Bill says...
7:53pm Thu 6 Aug 09

The Police 'Service' as it used to be has over the years lost respect and lost control of the situation. This has largely come about through the respect and control being taken away, rather than given up. It has happened as a result of the plethora of newer and more 'inclusive' legislation produced by both Brussels and Westminster. On top of this we now have vastly better news media and communications than in even the recent past.The result is a perception of crime being much worse, the phrase used by politicians is: Fear of Crime. Something Nu-labour said that they would deal with....

Security companies such as this try fill this apparent gap in the market and play up the fear rather than any facts. It happened in New York many years ago with the 'Guardian Angels' This prompted the NY Transit Police to get their act together and the GA are no longer necessary. They tried to start it on London Transport but lasted less than a week as I recall.

It does not help the discussion if the News media keep calling these Security Guards 'Officers', 'Cops' and even 'Police'. They are none of these things, in order to be so called they would require a regulatory Act of Parliament, as is the case with Parks Police and others.

gorf says...
8:55pm Thu 6 Aug 09

how about thornhill / harefield / townhill park

B. L. says...
9:30pm Thu 6 Aug 09

X Old Bill wrote:
The Police 'Service' as it used to be has over the years lost respect and lost control of the situation. This has largely come about through the respect and control being taken away, rather than given up. It has happened as a result of the plethora of newer and more 'inclusive' legislation produced by both Brussels and Westminster. On top of this we now have vastly better news media and communications than in even the recent past.The result is a perception of crime being much worse, the phrase used by politicians is: Fear of Crime. Something Nu-labour said that they would deal with....

Security companies such as this try fill this apparent gap in the market and play up the fear rather than any facts. It happened in New York many years ago with the 'Guardian Angels' This prompted the NY Transit Police to get their act together and the GA are no longer necessary. They tried to start it on London Transport but lasted less than a week as I recall.

It does not help the discussion if the News media keep calling these Security Guards 'Officers', 'Cops' and even 'Police'. They are none of these things, in order to be so called they would require a regulatory Act of Parliament, as is the case with Parks Police and others.
At last, someone who can see the wood for the trees, as well as P.B. You are absolutely right, the country is controlled by Brussels who are probably laughing their socks off at the plight of "Great Britain" (keep the subsidies coming). The monkeys in Westminster try to appear in control but the only control they are interested in is taxing everyone to the hilt with zero return, except for themselves. Your last paragraph is spot on, this is no more than a protection scam. They have no authority whatsoever, no matter what power they believe themselves to have, and if people believe this is the answer to REAL policing, then the place is in a sorrier state than one can imagine.I don't always agree with his political stance, but for once I totally agree with Paramjit Bahia's post, he tells it the way it should be. People, if you place your trust in these wannabees, your future doesn't look too bright and I really feel for you.

Incidentally, it takes a very long time to become a Police Officer because of the complexities of the law and inherent training needed. Need I say anymore ?

theworldisfullofcrashingbores says...
10:42pm Thu 6 Aug 09

maybe not such a bad idea. If they fail to do their job, or prove themselfs to be violent little thugs in uniforms residents can stop paying them and in effect sack them - a bit better than current situation!

Mr BCB says...
10:59pm Thu 6 Aug 09

As a retired police officer some 23 years ago it pains me to see that extra private forces are required. If the local police were patrolling at the strength it was in 1980 then no extra police help would be required. Many of the senior officers do not know the problem areas and have never policed them at grass roots level. They learn about the psychology of policing at the police college without having gained the necessary practical police experience on the ground. They then advocate that beat work is not the order of the day. We do need the police on the beat getting to know the community and building up a rapport and respect. What we currently have is a shambles where the police have lost control. I advise that the police return to their original police objectives where the man on the beat is considered to be one of the more important aspects which involves the protection of people and property and the bringing to justice of offenders.

driverbelcher says...
11:12pm Thu 6 Aug 09

dyjps wrote:
Do you remember back in the 1600's when you insured your property against fire and had a plaque on the wall to say so. Will those who pay have to do the same? No plaque = no protection?
Erm, no I don't remember back in the 1600's because this would make me around 400 years old! What a ridiculous statement!!

Donald2000 says...
6:16am Fri 7 Aug 09

There is an important point to note which is that are these people CRB checked? My guess is they are not because that would involve them getting their CRB checks through a recognised intermediary and quite frankly no intermediary is going to authorise its name being used to check out a private security force of this nature with CRB. So, unchecked and unvetted they are going to wander the streets, provoking the very violence they seek to guard against. Good luck to them; I give them about a week before they give up. In my humble experience, it would take more than this lot have got to make coppers of them.

GDNeil says...
8:09am Fri 7 Aug 09

However effective or not these security guards are is not really the main issue. The sad fact is that, whether we like it or not, a large section of the law-abiding public have lost faith in the police to deal with rowdy, drunken and anti-social behaviour and minor crime which affects everyday life. Here in Gloucestershire we rarely see police officers, and when we do it is just to see a marked car speed by. In the evenings our town centres are virtually no-go areas, given over to rowdy, foul-mouthed, drunken gangs of youths, fighting and vomiting in the streets, with not a police officer in sight. Certainly, not pleasant places to take one's family for an evening stroll. Until the police begin patrolling the streets, talking and communicating with people and dealing with such disgusting and appalling behaviour many more decent people will continue to lose faith in them, allowing these private security firms to fill the vacuum.

peachy1 says...
8:42am Fri 7 Aug 09

Its getting like Iraq soon they will be competing with other companies to run specific areas the next thing you'll have a "TURF WAR" Its the same people who started the Camping cmpanies up yeas ago they are gangsters in uniforms

Sierra33 says...
11:48am Fri 7 Aug 09

There are quite a lot of CCTV security cameras along Shirley High Street, and I have noticed the community police officers patrolling around the area when visiting the place.

If anything, the drug problem in the neighbourhood really needs tackling, and there have been reports in the local newspaper about Southampton being one of the main cannabis factories in the UK: rented detached houses in reasonable areas being used for these purposes.

The impact of the drug problem in the vicinity affects everyone in the community. Maybe if this were sorted out, there wouldn’t be the need for the private security officers as the crime rate could be greatly reduced.

mamamia24 says...
3:23pm Fri 7 Aug 09

Last week alone violence on our streets made headline front page news; on at least two occasions that I recall. One relating to 4 stabbings, 2 of which were near fatal within a 24 hour period. All were within one mile proximety to each other. The other incident relates to some poor old guy, who was punched to the ground in Shirley and prceeded to have his head kicked and stamped on like a COKE CAN by multiple thugs, to the point his face was so beaten and swollen that I doubt his own mom would have recognised him. Yet there was no immediate police or Community Patrol intervention or anyone else on hand to help. I wonder if any of the individuals who were on the recieving end of these acts of gratuitious violence would have minded if a security patrol such as this was on hand to jump in? I pose the same question if it was any of you, who have posted so far with your clear indignation towards the whole idea. But I can't help wonder how fast would your tune change if the outcome of such a life changing assault was steered in the favor of you making it home relatively unscathed; due to the intervention of these guys, as opposed to waking up (assuming you survive the event) in hospital with a drip in your arm, whilst continuously dribbling in your new found paraplegic state? Bottom line is the police can't handle the current violent street crime situation, so someone, somewhere is now trying to do something in the direction of making local communities somewhat safer; it may be flawed, it may fall by the way side, more from lack of support than anything else, but atleast someone is attempting to DO SOMETHING!


Hundreds to pay for their own ‘police’ in Southampton Hundreds to pay for their own ‘police’ in Southampton

Most popular


Local Information

Enter your postcode, town or place name

House prices »   Schools »   Crime »   Hospitals »

Local Businesses